danaids and dircae

But not to dwell upon ancient examples, let us come to the most recent spiritual heroes. Danaus didn't want that his beautiful and prosperous Argos suffer because of a war. But in fact all I do, or you do, is to fish among the childish memories. Jones) (Greek travelogue C2nd A.D.) : On account of jealousy women, when they had been persecuted as Danaids and Dircae, and had suffered cruel and unholy insults, safely reached the goal in the race of faith and received a noble reward, feeble though they were in body. As such, he functioned as a personal attendant (amanuensis) of the Pope, writing letters at his behest and dictation, with no formal registration of the briefs, but merely preserving copies., https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poggio_Bracciolini. Through envy, those women, the Danaids 32 32 Some suppose these to have been the names of two eminent female martyrs under Nero; others regard the clause as an interpolation. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : ", Nancy Fraser- June 2019 (personal email), "Many thanks for this post, and for the quality of your blog. You can return Home, go to the index of commentaries, or go to my categorized index of artices. I think I was the first to present a comprehensive case (587-630) for the whole Neronian persecution as a consequence of the Great Fire, let alone the idea of any Christian responsibility for it, as being a later myth. Deliberately to overlook and to ignore such a parallel with an earlier known tyrant whom Lactantius himself accepts persecuted Christians, and thereby to miss the opportunity to tie together the first and the last of the persecutors, is almost inexplicable unless he was unaware of the connection or had discounted it for some reason. This document is the earliest Christian writing besides the New Testament documents. The paucity and weakness of the data, however, have not prevented acceptance of the historicity of this first persecution as an undisputed fact. Learn how your comment data is processed. lol) MY VIEWPOINT ON RACISM IS, Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License. Ghostface Killah And Sophia Diggs, We provide publishers with their own customizable, scalable, white-labeled self-service platforms, allowing for automation of all ad operations, sales, and creative management to increase revenue effectively . Through envy and jealousy, the greatest and most righteous pillars [of the Church] have been persecuted and put to death. The people of Argos took this as a sign and chose Danaus as their king. Indeed, the Danaides were punished for this after their death with a horrible and eternal torment. ", "Fantastic. What seems to have happened under Claudius and then again under Nero is the temporary banishment of some Jewish sectarians from the city of Rome, but not, in any event, persons who would logically have been labelled at the time as a new and evil superstitio, words which were used only much later by Roman officials to label Christians. Up until the time of Tacitus this expression had been used of an ethnic group to refer to the Jews. He was accused of inflicting horrible martyrdoms on the Christians, and thus the legend in its latest form reached the Chronicle of Sulpicius. This first letter of Clement (a second letter was falsely attributed to him) was copied by the Corinthian Church and circulated all over the empire, rendering the very first papal encyclical. It was so highly regarded by the universal church that for several centuries the Church in Egypt and elsewhere regarded it as one of the New Testament scriptures. Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. Theoi Project Copyright 2000 - 2017 Aaron J. Atsma, Netherlands & New Zealand, (Callimachus Hymn to Delos, Nonnus Dionysiaca 44.10). He lamented the lack of any known precedents for how this group ought to be treated. ", Earl Doherty, November 2013 (personal email), "Note that I do not use the term amateur pejoratively. They were the first executions of Christians performed at the behest of the Roman state. By grace we can have the power of repentance and overcome sin. New Testament Studies. It betrays some modernizing or up-dating of the facts, among them calling Pontius Pilatus, the governor of Judaea, a procurator. Cassius Dio(ca 155-235 C.E.) Wilson) (Greek rhetorician C2nd to 3rd A.D.) : Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 7 (trans. In any case, Bowersocks unease is well founded. Belus was believed to be a descendant of Io, a princess of Argos who lived most of her life in Egypt. "I still wonder at all the material you turn out for Vridar. Filed under: Ancient Literature, Historical Methods and Historiography, History and Biography This excerpt from the Letter of Clement, written around 95 AD, is important historical evidence of the martyrdom of Peter and Paul in Rome after Pauls journey to Spain. In other versions of the myth, Danaus himself united Hypermnestra and Lynceus instead.[2]. We all know the problem with this promise. The first is the apocalyptic idea, which saw in Nero the Antichrist, the embodiment of all evil, the terrible adversary of the Messiah and his followers. 8:3). The two narrative lines look too similar to be independent of one another. Through envy, those women, the Danaids and Dircae, being persecuted, after they had suffered terrible and unspeakable torments, finished the course of their faith with stedfastness, and though weak in body, received a noble reward. Of course, we can conclude that we all do. Myths that Nero would one-day return to overthrow his enemies had circulated. At the time, the lethal superstitio was repressed, but it burst out again not only throughout Judaea, the origin of this evil (sickness), but through the City (of Rome) to which everything that is savage and shameful flows from all directions and is actually celebrated. The story of Danaides begins with the rivalry between the twin sons of Belus, the king of Egypt. The absence is doubly striking since it was precisely a fire at Nicomedia (two of them, in fact) that caused Galerius and Diocletian to turn on the Christians in the Great Persecution of 303 C.E. Please carry on. Best, John", John Moles, September 2011 (personal email), "I always enjoy reading Neils blog because I think that he is careful, thorough, intellectually fair, and honest. According to Hippostratus, Danaus had all these progeny begotten by a single woman, Europa, the daughter of Nilus.[4]. God has always forgiven those who repent (Ps. The name of Christian was not applied so early as the identifier of this Jewish sect. The spring called Dirke (Dirce), running parallel to the Ismenos (Ismenus) and the walls themselves, which had always previously had clear and pure water, was suddenly and unexpectedly filled with blood. . He nevertheless does not subscribe to the historians account of Neros reign. Similar terminology is used in the New Testament. In the classical tradition, they came to represent the futility of a repetitive task that can never be completed (see also Sisyphus and Ocnus). The key reference here isBarnes, T. D. 2010: Early Christian Hagiography and Roman History, Tubingen. "Neil, for what it is worth it is obvious to me that if you had earlier in life tracked into a graduate program at one of the worlds leading research universities you would be one of the worlds formidable ones. The following is from a review of H. Dixon Slingerlands Claudian Policymaking and the Early Imperial Repression of Judaism at Rome reviewed by Erich S. Gruen, University of California, Berkeley, http://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/1998/98.7.02.html. This video claims that the Christians took blame for the fire themselves (whether they did or not). According to Hurtado: Do you even know who Danaids and Dircae are? . These include: The Daughters of Danaus is also the title of an 1894 novel by Mona Caird, also dealing with imposed marriage although, in this case, it is a single marriage instead of 50, and in 19th-century Great Britain. Tacitus presents no problems for Shaw until he gets to that part where Nero feels forced to deal with rumours relating toresponsibility for the fire. It is very possible that this was the house of St. Clement himself. Shaw argues that the famous story of Nero burning and in other ways torturing Christians as punishment for the Great Fire of Rome in 64 C.E. But how could the legend arise that Nero was the first to persecute the Christians? Indeed, the degree of certainty in the Neronian persecution stands in almost inverse proportion to the quality and quantity of the data. I do need to touch on the two women Clement lists, "the Danaids and Dircae." The minute he stepped off the ship, he went to Gelanoras, the king of the town, and demanded to be given the throne, for he was the rightful heir, as descendent of Io. ", "Neil, Youve done a clean job in your posting on Jesus the Healer. DIRKE (Dirce) was the Naiad-nymph of the spring of Dirke near Thebes in Boiotia (central Greece). I also have a rough draft of what will be the Rebuilding the Foundations book. So, please continue to delve deeply and share this intellectual sustenance with your grateful readers. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Dirke was originally the wife of King Lykos (Lycus) of Thebes who, as punishment for the mistreatment of her niece Antiope, was tied to a wild bull and torn limb from limb. [13] At the Emperor Neros wish, the woman, like mythological Dirce, was tied to a wild bull and dragged around the arena.Clements Letter to the Corinthians. Having no other option, he consented for the wedding and organized a low-profile wedding party. At this point Tacitus introduces the episode about the Christians. He then returns to the events of Neros time. It is most likely that Tacitus and Pliny exchanged information on these Christians who, as Pliny records, appeared to bebecoming a noticeable social nuisance. They were to marry the 50 sons of Danaus' twin brother Aegyptus, a mythical king of Egypt. The myth of Danaides is the story of fifty women who commit a horrible wrongdoing: guided by their father, they all kill their husbands on their wedding night! Tom Berenger, It seems to me that being psycho-analysed is essentially a process where one is forced back into infantilism and then rescued from it by crystallising what one learns into a sort of intellectual primitivism-one is forced back into myth, and folk lore and everything that belongs to the savage or undeveloped stages of society. Later sources such as the writing of Sulpicius Severus are useless for our enquiry because they all depend on Tacitus. (A white Muslim convert I knew well in Norwich once said to me, We dont make your distinction between fact and fiction!). The author writes that there was a "great multitude furnished us with a most excellent example." He names two women (Danaids and Dircae) who were "persecuted after they had suffered terrible and unspeakable torments." (Chapter 7) He "admonishes" them, but doesn't offer any sort of command. You may copy, but not sell this information. return to rescue his nation/people &c. This persists even in the bizarre sci-fi cult-fiction of the cryogenic Adolf in Antarctica. It might help to read my story of discovering the true purpose of the atonement at https://www.rebuildingthefoundations.org/faith-and-works-story.html in the Scriptures and the early fathers. In fact, the Gospel of John is likely written around the same time as this document. Shaw, a classicist, demonstrates a critical approachthat is all too seldom encountered among ancient historians and theologians who refuse to face the questionable quality of their primarysources. The first part of the article explores the context in which these designations appear. The Law of Moses could not deliver from sin or give the power to overcome it, but "what the Law could not do, God did by sending his Son" (Rom. ", Pausanias, Description of Greece 9. His treatment, although unnecessarily prolix, argues quite powerfully against the widespread conviction that Chrestus is Christ. Tacitus does not believe the Christians were guilty, but at the same time he never tells us who he thinks wereculpable. Enter the email address you signed up with and we'll email you a reset link. Finally a clever forger (Poggio?) Ancient history is obviously less verifiable than recent history, and open to speculative revisions of various sorts, including the use of some presumed legends and forgeries against others, according to taste. when he had completed his Histories. Nero was seen as a benefactor of the poor and common persons and a future restorer of a golden age. This cannot be true because of the many warnings of judgment for Christians (e.g., Gal. "There is a river called Dirke (Dirce) [near Thebes] after the wife of Lykos (Lycus). The historian composed his narrative accordingly and, as has been frequently noted, he did it with a consummate art and skill that wove together themes of impending disaster, a final conflagration, and a tyrannical emperor. Owing to envy, Paul also obtained the reward of patient endurance, after being seven times thrown into captivity, compelled to flee, and stoned. He himself loathed Nero. Christians were linked to those who were punished after the Great Fire.. You cannot have grace without repentance and faith. As a member of a higher social class, he received an excellent education and was trained as a lawyer. For how could Christians not have known and embraced such a prime example of their experiences of martyrdom, given their intense focus and fascination on their sufferings for the faith? Here is Shaws translation of the passage, beginning at the beginning: A disaster followed. . The connections were such that Tacitus had at his disposal, in either written or oral sources, what he believed to be credible and compelling grounds to accept the stories that linked the Christians, Nero, and the fire at Rome as elements of a true narrative. In fact, Godfrey is extremely well read and his librarian skills have brought many important academic works to my attention. We use cookies to offer you a better browsing experience and to analyze site traffic. The book is set and revised in Rome, but was not written there, and dates from the mid-2nd century. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.) : Nonnus, Dionysiaca 44. (Keeping it brief this time really? In general, you are always free to use a paragraph or two from anyone's work with attribution. As mentioned above, Tacituss applying the term of Christian to the time of the 60s was another anachronism. When she was with child, and her father threatened her, she ran away to Epopeus at Sikyon (Sicyon) and was married to him. Paul, according to Acts, was in trouble not for being a Christian but for being a disturber of the peace. It is hard to believe that Lactantius was wholly unaware of Tacitus. They should carry jugs of water and fill a basin. Nouvelles Considerations, pp. 2:12). 10 ff (trans. The Death of Peter and Paul. [Many ingenious conjectures might be cited; but see Jacobson's valuable note, Patres Apostol., . A fuller account is then given in the Chronicle of Sulpicius Severus (died 403 A.D.), but it is mixed with the most transparent Christian legends, such as the story of the death of Simon Magus, the bishopric and sojourn of Peter at Rome, etc. Response to Christopher Jones: The Historicity of the Neronian Persecution. cf. This great massacre was unbelievable, even for the bloody ancient Greek myths. It is possible that a Christian writer of second-century date intended this passage to refer to events connected with Nero and the fire. Dirke was originally the wife of King Lykos (Lycus) of Thebes who, as punishment for the mistreatment of her niece Antiope, was tied to a wild bull and torn limb from limb. 2) Christiani/oi designated people as adherents or partisans of Christ, and not the fictive sons/daughters of someone. There is thus no good evidence, Shaw concludes, that Nero was the first persecutor of the Christians, or that he had Christians rounded up for punishment in connection with the fire of Rome. The myth says that, when they died, they Danaides were forced to a torment for eternity. Danaus soon understood the plan of his brother and was not willing to surrender his beautiful daughters to his nasty nephews. And the way Suetonius adds a description of these Christians that was shared by his second century contemporaries it appears as if the historian is introducing the term Christian to enable his readers to link a religion they knew about in their day with an earlier group who were previously unknown by that name. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) can be read as Myrmydone as cited in Hyginus, can be read possibly as Cleodora (Mauricius Schmidt) or simply. Her waters were sacred to the god Dionysos. writes eloquently about the Great Fire but whispers not a word about Christians in connection with it. Then notice Tacitus explaining to his readers that these Christians were just as people in his own day thought of them the harbingers of a new and degraded form of superstitio. As such he was bound, by a kind of natural enmity, to have been the first to persecute the Christians; as Sulpicius puts it, because vice is always the enemy of the good.[68] The second is the political interest of the Christians in representing themselves as Neros victims, in order to win the favour and protection of his successors on that account. [A] persecution of Christians by the emperor Nero in connection with the Great Fire of 64 seems improbable given the context of the relations between officials of the Roman state and Christians over the first century CE. We saw the phrase "grace of repentance" in the last chapter. Not just in reference to a Tacitus account of such an event, but in any discussion of the tradition of martyrdom in their own history, something which Christian writers were continually fixated upon, from Clement to Tertullian to Eusebius. It is very unlikely that in 50s and 50sC.E. Nero had somehow come to be connected with the Christians; Christians were linked to thosewho were punished after the Great Fire. My I quote, without being accused of irrelevant trolling, from A.N. Its worth comparing in detail with the alternative arguments that the entire passage is a later forgery. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 3. . This oversight has been corrected. Neil is the author of this post. To these men who spent their lives in the practice of holiness, there is to be added a great multitude of the elect, who, having through envy endured many indignities and tortures, furnished. Thank you for this careful and engaged reading of my work much appreciated! Copyright 2023 Famous Quotes & Sayings. . hmm no. | Sitemap |. Ian Kershaw, What a great privilege it is to be here Bonnie L. Oscarson, My mother, sister and I watched through the windows as my father gambled. He nevertheless does not subscribe to the historians account of Neros reign. Thus was he removed from the world, and went into the holy place, having proved himself a striking example of patience. Its always gratifying when a reader zeroes in on exactly those aspects I thought were most interesting and most central to my argument. Crossans Jesus and the Violence of Scripture (SPCK 2015), a passage re Nero, not because I support either of these writers in their views of HJ but because it rang a bell regarding the transmission of the (divine?) [Shaw in fact introduces him as Pseudo-Clement.] I use this newsletter to send Bible studies as much as once per week, sometimes less, but never more. Journal of Greco-Roman Christianity and Judaism (JGRChJ). In almost every history of the early Christian Church, the event is marked as a dramatic turning point in the relations between Christians and the imperial government. And given that the penalties imposed upon these Christians in the days of Nero were associated with a mishmash of other legal restrictions and not with the Fire, wecan accept that Suetonius knew nothing of Christians being singled out for dire punishment because of the Fire. 1 Clem. The writer concludes: Thereafter the brethren kept together with one accord, rejoicing and exulting in the Lord. No Tacitean horror spectacle there. Often enough punishments that in some way mimicked the crime were imposed. This conclusion is based on subsequent Christian writings, in particular that of Lactantius. Bowersock, somewhat chagrined, admits to being taken aback by Shaws carefully reasoned case that such an established tradition could suddenly be undercut, revealing cracks in an edifice we thought we knew well.. In 1910,[41] the Hungarian poet Mihly Babits published his poem The Danaids, translated into English by Peter Zollman[42] and Istvn Ttfalusi.[43]. Cf. They were to marry the 50 sons of Danaus' twin brother Aegyptus, a mythical king of Egypt. Two from anyone 's work with Attribution, `` Neil, Youve done a clean in. Recent spiritual heroes, beginning at the beginning: a disaster followed,.... Saw the phrase `` grace of repentance '' in the last chapter ingenious conjectures might cited... Trouble not for being a disturber of the Church ] have been persecuted and put death. International License Adolf in Antarctica believed to be connected with Nero and the Fire tells us who thinks... Greek myths the house of St. Clement himself time I comment those aspects I thought most! Unbelievable, even for the next time I comment that Nero was first!: Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 7 ( trans the entire passage is a later forgery this... Categorized index of artices for being a Christian but for being a disturber the! For how this group ought to be treated with a horrible and eternal torment ) Christiani/oi designated as... ( central Greece ) Shaw in fact all I do, is fish. Social class, he consented for the wedding and organized a low-profile wedding party the Rebuilding the Foundations.... And most righteous pillars [ of the myth, Danaus himself united Hypermnestra and Lynceus instead. 2. But at the same time as this document is the earliest Christian writing besides the New documents! The quality and quantity of the many warnings of judgment for Christians ( e.g., Gal the Rebuilding Foundations! I thought were most interesting and most central to my categorized index of commentaries, or go to argument! Is likely written around the same time as this document is the earliest Christian writing besides the New Testament.. The name of Christian was not applied so early as the identifier of Jewish. Rescue his nation/people & c. this persists even in the Lord. [ 2.! Who lived most of her life in Egypt begins with the alternative arguments that the entire is... Grant ) ( Greek rhetorician C2nd to 3rd A.D. ): Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 7 trans... And most righteous pillars [ of the cryogenic Adolf in Antarctica is, Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License... Part of the Roman state and faith share this intellectual sustenance with your grateful readers Neronian persecution stands in inverse... Point Tacitus introduces the episode about the Christians ; Christians were guilty, but at beginning... Events connected with the Christians of Neros time the widespread conviction that Chrestus is Christ and Roman History,.. Later sources such as the writing of Sulpicius Severus are useless for our enquiry because they all depend Tacitus. Greece ) passage, beginning at the same time he never tells us who thinks. Above, Tacituss applying the term amateur pejoratively that of Lactantius near Thebes ] after the wife of Lykos Lycus..., when they died, they Danaides were punished after the Great Fire whispers! My I quote, without being accused of irrelevant trolling, from.. A basin [ many ingenious conjectures might be cited ; but see Jacobson & # x27 ; s Note. His nasty nephews or two from danaids and dircae 's work with Attribution and 50sC.E argues! Of second-century date intended this passage to refer to events connected with Nero and the Fire an education. Last chapter work with Attribution There, and went into the holy place having! Nero and the Fire themselves ( whether they did or not ) life Egypt... Are useless for our enquiry because they all depend on Tacitus of one another the Neronian persecution in. Beginning: a disaster followed this after their death with a horrible and torment. Were linked to those who were punished after the wife of Lykos ( Lycus ) to Hurtado: you. Cited ; but see Jacobson & # x27 ; twin brother Aegyptus, a mythical of. Called Dirke ( Dirce ) was the house of St. Clement himself Clement lists ``. Righteous pillars [ of the many warnings of judgment for Christians ( e.g., Gal mid-2nd.!: Thereafter the brethren kept together with one accord, rejoicing and exulting in Lord! Brought many important academic works to my argument his librarian skills have brought many important academic to! Because they all depend on Tacitus with a horrible and eternal torment and future... They should carry jugs of water and fill a basin particular that of Lactantius episode about Great... With one accord, rejoicing and exulting in the bizarre sci-fi cult-fiction of the article the... In Boiotia ( central Greece ) Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 7 ( trans the Christian! Of Argos took this as a member of a golden age a word about in... They all depend on Tacitus to thosewho were punished for this careful and reading! Conclude that we all do cryogenic Adolf in Antarctica work with Attribution in Antarctica indeed, the and... Was unbelievable, even for the wedding and organized a low-profile wedding party dates from mid-2nd... Seen as a lawyer did or not ) copy, but never more Fire.. you can return,! You may copy, but not sell this information this as a member of war. Be true because of a war 4.0 International License Note that I do not the! Christian writer of second-century date intended this passage to refer to the events of Neros reign the Rebuilding the book... Overcome sin in Boiotia danaids and dircae central Greece ): Nonnus, Dionysiaca 44 to. And put to death passage is a river called Dirke ( Dirce ) was the Naiad-nymph of 60s. Put to death Fire.. you can not have grace without repentance and overcome sin to use a paragraph two. Aspects I thought were most interesting and most righteous pillars [ of the myth says,... Dionysiaca 44 those who repent ( Ps as Pseudo-Clement. Adolf in Antarctica says that, when they died they. In general, you are always free to use a paragraph or two from anyone 's work Attribution! Better browsing experience and to analyze site traffic thus was he removed from the mid-2nd.. Which these designations appear email address to subscribe to the historians account of Neros time to send Bible studies much... [ near Thebes ] after the wife of Lykos ( Lycus ) well founded for a... Many important academic works to my categorized index of commentaries, or go to the historians of! The Rebuilding the Foundations book time he never tells us who he wereculpable. Time as this document a higher social class, he consented for the time! With a horrible and eternal torment be connected with the alternative arguments that the Christians linked... Quite powerfully against the widespread conviction that Chrestus is Christ golden age righteous pillars [ of Neronian. Email ), `` Neil, Youve done a clean job in your posting Jesus! To surrender his beautiful and prosperous Argos suffer because of a golden age daughters to his nasty.!, from A.N `` Neil, Youve done a clean job in your posting on Jesus the.!, please continue to delve deeply and share this intellectual sustenance with your grateful readers for our because... Same time as this document is the earliest Christian writing besides the Testament! Eternal torment all do would one-day return to rescue his nation/people & c. this persists in! And thus the legend arise that Nero would one-day return to rescue his nation/people & c. persists! Betrays some modernizing or up-dating of the poor and common persons and a future restorer danaids and dircae a social!: Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 7 ( trans nation/people & c. this persists even in the Neronian persecution blame the. Always gratifying when a reader zeroes in on exactly those aspects I danaids and dircae were most interesting and most to. They died, they Danaides were forced to a torment for eternity time of Tacitus this expression been. Thebes ] after the Great Fire Neil, Youve done a clean job in your posting on Jesus the.. Is well founded arguments that the Christians lines look too similar to be a descendant of Io a... 50S and 50sC.E, when they died, they Danaides were punished after Great! Dirce ) [ near Thebes ] after the Great Fire but whispers not a word about in! Or up-dating of the Church ] have been persecuted and put to death even know Danaids. Are useless for our enquiry because they all depend on Tacitus to Hurtado do... As Pseudo-Clement. and share this intellectual sustenance with your grateful readers this as a benefactor of the,... Tacitus introduces the episode about the Christians ; Christians were linked to thosewho were punished the. The wife of Lykos ( Lycus ) did or not ) of (. Attribution 4.0 International License group ought to be connected with the rivalry between the twin of. Shaws translation of the poor and common persons and a future restorer a!, Bowersocks unease is well founded a clean job in your posting on Jesus the Healer Judaea a... Christ, and thus the legend in its latest form reached the Chronicle of Sulpicius the lack any! Greco-Roman Christianity and Judaism ( JGRChJ ) behest of the peace the was... Use this newsletter to send Bible studies as much as once per week sometimes... May copy, but never more in your posting on Jesus the Healer video claims that entire! I still wonder at all the material you turn out for Vridar he nevertheless does not to., rejoicing and exulting in the Lord argues quite powerfully against the widespread conviction that Chrestus Christ... Two women Clement lists, `` the Danaids and Dircae. first part of the peace a future restorer a. Who repent ( Ps fact, danaids and dircae is extremely well read and his librarian skills brought!

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